You Must Undo What You've Done

[Siamese Sith]

We all know about the feature on the prequel DVD's called "undelete" right? Well I know some of you out there may like this idea....
How nice would it be to have a special feature on the OT DVD's called "redelete". Ahhh, no more stupid Jabba scene in ANH...till they can do it right! And lets forget about Greedo shootin first BLEEP! gone!
Ah the miracle of digital technology!

[DblDwn]

Actually the Jabba scene in ANH is kinda cool because we see Jabba actually moving around like in TPM and we also see a brief shot of Boba Fett. The only thing that makes it appear stupid is when Han steps on Jabba's tail but that was necessary in order to get Harrison to walk behind the actor that was originally filmed since Jabba was supposed to be a human until ROTJ.

[Darth Badly]

The Han/Jabba scene has some shockingly bad CGI work in it. I hope to heaven that if they must keep that pointless additional scene in the DVD release of ANH at least they'll redo the CGI and make it look better.

[Justin]

I just hope they release both versions on the same DVD. Hey, isn't there already a thread for this?

[Sgt_Jedi]

The Han/Jabba scene in ANH is not a "pointless" scene. It was meant to be there all along. 1977 Technology prevented it from making the final cut. This scene clearly explains Han's situation much better. It also explains why he always wants to leave Luke and Leia better.

[Mothman]

The only point of the Jabba scene was to justify selling tickets to the Special Edition. It should have stayed on the cutting room floor, where it had been lying since 1977. When GL says that he was *always* going to replace the actor with some kind of creature but ran out of time and/or money, that's just a load of crap!

[Jedi D'oh]

and you know this how? ???

[Mothman]

GL gave many interviews at the time that the Special Editions came out, claiming that he had always originally intended on including the Jabba scene with a creature instead of the human actor that he filmed. But he ran out of time and/or money.

I'm just glad he didn't include it in 1977.

[Jedi D'oh]

What I meant was how do you know it was a load of crap? I have a video called From Star Wars To Jedi:The Making Of A Saga. In that video, released shortly after ROTJ, he talks about the scene and even has some clips from it.

He stated even back then that the human was to be replaced by a stop motion creature, but never happened. That left the freedom to create Jabba as he is.

[Luvinna.]

Originally posted by Siamese sith@Oct 29 2002, 10:25 PM
We all know about the feature on the prequel DVD's called "undelete" right?
Huh? style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/eh.gif ???

[Mothman]

Originally posted by jedi-d'oh@Oct 31 2002, 12:25 PM
What I meant was how do you know it was a load of crap? I have a video called From Star Wars To Jedi:The Making Of A Saga. In that video, released shortly after ROTJ, he talks about the scene and even has some clips from it.

He stated even back then that the human was to be replaced by a stop motion creature, but never happened. That left the freedom to create Jabba as he is.
Somewhere (way back when), I saw the cut scene with the human actor. The actor spoke the same lines as the Special Edition CG Jabba (except in English) with a Scottish accent. He wasn't some stage hand or extra filling in with the lines. He was a large fellow (in girth, not height) and he was wearing a costume, not street clothes.

To me, it appears that that was the scene as GL had intended it to be in 1977 -- and intended to include in the finished film. In retrospect, he just got lucky since he had cut it before the final print. Because of that, he could create the ROTJ Jabba that we are all familiar with.

Remember that the "Making Of..." video that you are referring to still was made around or after the release of ROTJ -- not before. To me, it's just another example of how GL lies his way around things. He's not some grand master planner (like Palpatine/Sidious). He's just making it up as he goes along (like Indiana Jones).

[Jedi D'oh]

I know the vid came out after ROTJ, even said so in the post. Point being, The actor playing Jabba in that scene, whether or not he was to be replaced, is more belivable to the actors around if he is in costume as everyone else.

I agree with you that some of this newer stuff GL claims to have already had in an outline seems a stretch. I wonder how much he's made up and how much is real. Just because he says something doesn't make it law, but it also doesn't mean because he had a n idea that didn't happen or was not realized, does not mean he's lying about it all went down.

[Mothman]

In interviews, GL always makes it seem like everything is part of some great big master plan that he wrote in the mid-70's. I'm not buying the act. He just got lucky.

I remember comments from Gary Kurtz (ANH producer). He said that they wanted the film to feel like you walked in in the middle of it. In my opinion, that's why GL came up with the backstory -- so he himself would know why certain characters were doing what they were doing. It wasn't so he could make a 9 (now 6) episode saga.

The Star Wars approach to storytelling certainly was revolutionary when you compare it to other films in that era. But... most of the time, I think GL is pulling a fast one on us.

[Jedi D'oh]

You know, sometimes i have those very thoughts.

[Sgt_Jedi]

Either way, big lies or not, the Jabba scene in ANH was always meant to be there.

[Siamese Sith]

God I hate posting on my own threads but...watch TPM and look at the CGI Jabba then watch ANH SE. Holy major difference batman! SE Jabba looks smaller and has horribly animated facial features, and the eyes EGAD!

[Jedi D'oh]

See, the stuff in the SE was a test of the CGI to see how it would look. Ever compared TPM to AOTC? HUGE difference. Almost like between the 2 movies is like the OT to the PT. I figure after III, Lucas is going to use the existing technology to make all that look better.

[bodhisattva yoda]

did george ever say that he intended to superimpose a stop-motion creature over the actor? maybe he used an actor in place of a creature because, like he says, he ran out of time and money. perhaps that's why the scene wasn't to his satisfaction.

[Jedi D'oh]

Yes, on that video he says he wanted to use a stop motion creature. The scene was filmed and finished, but the money and time to put in the creature effect ran out, so it was scrapped.

[Krogenar]

Could it be that Gl was looking at TPM and the old films and realized that there was such a technology lag between them that he wanted to intersperse the earlier movies with some of the same digital creatures that we see in the new prequels? That way they would seem more 'connected'? Or more homogenized?

[Jedi D'oh]

No. I think, as I said before, That the CGI in the special edition was a test of it, as well as a taste of what was to come, as well as a revenue generator.

[Mothman]

Follow the money.....

[Krogenar]

Originally posted by Jedi D'oh@Nov 4 2002, 04:49 PM
No. I think, as I said before, That the CGI in the special edition was a test of it, as well as a taste of what was to come, as well as a revenue generator.
*ponder* No.

I think you're oversimplifying it. I'm not saying that money wasn't one of GL's reasons - I'm just saying I think one of his reasons could have been artistic. If I were him, and looked back at the OT and compared it to the state of moviemaking technology today, I might want to give the OT a sprucing up as well.

I think the 6 films will ultimately flow together better if they're not so distant in terms of special effects.

[Jedi D'oh]

Did you read that whole quote or just the end of it. It said "AS WELL AS A REVENUE GENERATOR"

Yes, it was a sprucing up of the trilogy. That was the point. BUT....it was also a taste of what was to come. He may have to touch it up again because even now AOTC puts the SE to shame as far as the CGI goes. Tell me I'm wrong.

[Siamese Sith]

Hey special K style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tongue.gif How's going? I got a nasty cold style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/scatter.gif
A long time ago, before TPM, I was told by someone I worked with that Lucas was gonna go back once again and rework 80-90% of the special FX in the OT. I almost feel like these prequels are a kinda testing ground for that. Honestly I think if he left the "real" actors alone and just updated the OT it might not be so bad style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/eh.gif

[Jedi D'oh]

My point exactly. But you know, even TPM needs to be redone. Have you compared the two? (TPM and AOTC)

Big difference.

[Siamese Sith]

The only problem w/ that is once your done getting one up to date then another one will need to be updated and the cycle goes on and on...
When is it gonna be good enough?

[Jedi D'oh]

After III. If GL redoes the efffects in themovies to match the CGI in III, they will all be of the same date and look the same. After that, who cares?

[Luvinna.]

I say again:

Originally posted by Luvinna+Oct 31 2002, 02:38 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Luvinna @ Oct 31 2002, 02:38 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'><!--QuoteBegin-Siamese sith@Oct 29 2002, 10:25 PM
We all know about the feature on the prequel DVD's called "undelete" right?
Huh? style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/eh.gif ???[/b][/quote]
Umm... No. We don't all know about the feature on the prequel DVD's called "undelete". What are you talking about?

[Jedi D'oh]

There is no feature on the DVD called undelete. What that means: It was on TOS and the stuff that is in the deleted scenes for the DVD is now featured in the Databank.

[Siamese Sith]

Originally posted by Jedi D'oh@Nov 6 2002, 02:58 PM
There is no feature on the DVD called undelete. What that means: It was on TOS and the stuff that is in the deleted scenes for the DVD is now featured in the Databank.
Really? I could have swore when you are watching the second disk with the deleted scenes, the ones that are re-inserted into the film are labeled undelete.

[Jedi D'oh]

I never noticed that. I will look tonight when I get home and check that out. style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif

[Siamese Sith]

I'm pretty sure I'm right.....I hope so style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wacko.gif

[Jedi D'oh]

I'll post my findings here in the morning, bro. You may be right, I've just never payed attention to it.

[Siamese Sith]

So what's the verdict, am I crazy?

[Jedi D'oh]

I'm sorry to say it but I must say yes!! style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tongue.gif

I JUST NOW checked it out and the only thing it said was the AIR TAXI scene was "reincorporated." Everything else was called "deleted scene #..."

[Siamese Sith]

Ah well crazy is as crazy does....

[Darth Whaler]

Originally posted by Justin@Oct 30 2002, 07:16 PM
I just hope they release both versions on the same DVD.
I'm with you Justin. Anyone ever see the Abyss Special Edition DVD? At the main menu, you can choose to watch the original version or the special edition version (with deleted scenes reincorporated). I hope Lucas goes with a similar approach.

[Siamese Sith]

There's no reason why he couldn't AND shouldn't, except he's notorious for releasing updated version after updated version. Someone suggested somewhere in here that he might come do that with the "ultimate edition".