Zahn's Luke And Mara Novel Out In 2004

[ron bond 007]

I can't wait for Tim Zahn's new SW novel which will be about Luke and Mara and will be set 3 years after The Hand of Thrawn and will be out sometime in 2004. This book might explain how Mara got her disease in NJO.
This was confimed by Zahn himself at an Internet radio show called Interstellar transmissions.

I wonder who the villian will be and I hope to see some cool space battles. Since Zahn captures the face and flavor so well in his Thrawn trilogy and the Hand of Thrawn duology.

His Outbound Flight Project novel will be out after Episode III is released which could be summer or fall of 2005. That should be really be interesting since it explains the entire Outbound Flight Project incident and Thrawn's involvement in it and we should see the Unknown Regions in that one since the OFP passes through the UR in that one.

[Jedi D'oh]

That's pretty cool. I always liked Zahn's novels. I thought they were masterfully done. His return to the SW universe is long anticipated.

[jade51999]

We actually know how mara got her disease
nom anor was on Monor III (i think that's the name) the planet where mara was for a diplomatic mission..he let the coomb spores out into the air..and she got infected...

but anywhoo i'm SUPER excited.. b/c hopefuly it'll explain where lovely mara was through YJK

[JediKeri.]

Man I gotta wait 2 years?!?! I'm gonna go crazy in that time...

[ron bond 007]

Maybe we'll see Luke and Mara travel around the galaxy while training new Jedi which is what they said they would do at the end of VOTF. Perhaps they will have an adventure in the Unknown Regions which is also what Luke said at the end of VOTF of where their future would be:in the UR.

[James T. Skywalker]

Originally posted by jade51999@Oct 7 2002, 05:14 PM
We actually know how mara got her disease
nom anor was on Monor III (i think that's the name) the planet where mara was for a diplomatic mission..he let the coomb spores out into the air..and she got infected...
Actually, it was Monor II. And he painted the coomb spores in the breath masks that were to be used for an outdoor reception (the atmosphere of Monor II was toxic). That was how he transmitted the disease.

~JTS

[RedMirax]

COOL!!!!!!!! Maybe Mirax will be in it!!! style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif

[jade51999]

Thanks JTS! (BTW where was that actually written? i remember reading it but i can't remember where..)

[vodo]

when is it set and where can I see the marrige of Mara and luke

[jade51999]

The marriage of Luke and Mara occured *before *Vector Prime in a 4 set comic book called Union (not the best thing in the world it was cute)

you can buy it here on www.bn.com
http://search.barnesandnoble.com/booksearc...isbn=1569714649 (http://search.barnesandnoble.com/booksearch/isbnInquiry.asp?userid=0C9D03XWLL&isbn=1569714649)

This Luke and Mara novel is set during the Young Jedi Knights era....b/c Mara was never mentioned in the entire series (mainly b/c the wedding and HAnd of Thrawn duology had not been written yet)...

style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif
p

Edit--yes i am an idiot..i ment before Vector Prime (or after Vision of the Future) i had just been up for hours studying for a midterm when i wrote that..all apologies..

[One Lad to Rule Them All]

Originally posted by jade51999@Oct 8 2002, 10:44 AM
The marriage of Luke and Mara occured after Vector Prime in a 4 set comic book called Union (not the best thing in the world it was cute)

you can buy it here on www.bn.com
http://search.barnesandnoble.com/booksearc...isbn=1569714649 (http://search.barnesandnoble.com/booksearch/isbnInquiry.asp?userid=0C9D03XWLL&isbn=1569714649)

This Luke and Mara novel is set during the Young Jedi Knights era....b/c Mara was never mentioned in the entire series (mainly b/c the wedding and HAnd of Thrawn duology had not been written yet)...

style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif
p
The marraige occured before Vector Prime as they were married in the novel.

Check the timeline.

http://www.starwarz.com/timeline/#download

It's set just after Vision of the Future, which is 5 years before Vector Prime.

[Luvinna.]

Originally posted by jade51999@Oct 7 2002, 09:49 PM
Thanks JTS! (BTW where was that actually written? i remember reading it but i can't remember where..)
That info is revealed in Balance Point when Mara and Jaina run into Nom Anor on Duro.

I speculate that this forthcoming Luke and Mara novel will reveal Mara's past. Remember Luke's offer to help her recover her lost memories in VOTF?

(sorry, don't know where all the big words came from) style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wacko.gif

[jade51999]

doh!
sorry i knew that i just mistyped!

sorry i know this like the back of my hand...just was an idiot for a moment

[Brian]

TF.N has news on this book. Summary below:

The Mara Jade fansite Jade Crusades (http://www.jadecrusades.com/) recently conducted an interview with Tim Zahn about his upcoming Luke/Mara novel, in which he gave away a profane amount of information (all of which has been confirmed by a reliable source of ours). Here are the highlights:

- Titled "Survivor's Quest".

- Set 3 years after Hand of Thrawn duology

- "The Chiss have discovered the remains of Outbound Flight, and have invited Luke and Mara to examine the wreckage and make arrangements to return the wreckage back to the New Republic."

- Will tie in to his prequel book, which will cover the OFP and its destruction by Thrawn.

- Takes place entirely in the Unknown Regions, with no appearances by the other main characters.

A full transcript of the interview should be up soon; in the meantime their original report can be read here (http://www.jadecrusades.com/whatsnew.html)!


Source: TheForce.Net (http://www.theforce.net/books/index.shtml#18877)

[Whitesaber]

New novel?! A Zahn novel?!? <font style='width=80%; filter:glow(color=black)'>YEAH!!</font>

Mara got a disease?!? style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/unhappy.gif I didn't know that! Of course, I've just recently got into the EU and am currently on Vision of the Future. Haven't gone all the way to the New Jedi Order books yet.

O-B-Gates, posting links to TheForce.net? style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sly.gif Is that a good idea here?

[Brian]

Originally posted by Whitesaber@Jan 6 2003, 04:04 PM
O-B-Gates, posting links to TheForce.net? style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/sly.gif Is that a good idea here?
Nah, it's cool.

[Rogue_0009]

I actually prefer TF.N's books and humour sections [please don't hurt me]

[Whisper]

"Yes, the lynching will take place at zero six hundred hours..."

[JediKeri.]

Rogue 9 Ewwwwwwwwwwwwwww.....

[vodo]

I can provide the leeches

[Luvinna.]

It's nice to have some new info on the book, but after reading the interview, I do see the potential for creating a conflict with the NJO. See, Zahn said: The basic setup is that the Chiss have discovered the remains of Outbound Flight out in Chiss Space, and invite Luke and Mara to come out with them to examine the wreckage, and to make arrangements to get it back to New Republic Space.
Okay, here's my problem. In the NJO, in Stackpole's Onslaught, I believe, the Chiss show up and no one's ever heard of them. Until Luke mentions that he and Mara knew of them. So, unless the Chiss contact Luke and Mara directly instead of going through governmental chanels, and Luke and Mara don't tell any one where they're going or where they got the remains of the OFP when they get back, common sense dictates that the New Republic did know of the Chiss at the time of the NJO.

Tim Zahn isn't supposed to create problems like that, he's supposed to fix them!

It's possible that the Chiss contact them directly, but don't you think that Fel and Parck would be just a little miffed at Luke and Mara after what they did to the Hand of Thrawn's hanger bay? I don't think Luke and Mara ever revealed where they found that copy of the Caamas Document, so I guess all that could possibly be the way it happens.

Unfortunately, reading that interview just kind of made me wary of the book.

[Brian]

Cover and synopsis posted at starwars.com (http://www.starwars.com/eu/news/2003/06/news20030617b.html).

[Luvinna.]

Oooh! Cool! style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/biggrin.gif Now, get rid of the Shannon Baksa Mara on the cover and I'll be even happier.

Some parts of that synopsis still concern me...
Joining Luke and Mara Jade on their strange journey are an officer of the post-Palpatine Empire, escorted by a detachment of Imperial stormtroopers; a party of diplomats from a gentle alien species that reveres the fallen Jedi for saving them from blood-thirsty conquerors; and a New Republic ambassador who harbors his own mysterious agenda.
In the NJO, when the Chiss first showed up, everyone seemed so surprised. Not that they were there, but that they even existed. (Jaina: "Who are you?" Jag: "Only the best fighter squadron in the galaxy.") Everyone then got to talking about why no one knew about the Chiss when Luke spoke up and admited that he knew. But if there was a NR ambassador on the trip, doesn't that then imply that the NR knew about the Chiss and Nirauan? This worries me because it could cause major continutity problems (as if those don't already exist...). I guess my point is that TZ usually doesn't contribute to those conitnutity flaws (the only one he has been involved with is the placement of the Clone Wars in the EU timeline, but that's because Lucasfilm wouldn't give him a date, so he picked one). I don't want to see him start now. ???

[Brian]

TZ?

[Luvinna.]

Originally posted by O-B-GATES@Jun 18 2003, 11:11 AM
TZ?
Who's the book by, OB? style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink.gif

[James T. Skywalker]

According to the LFL editors over at sw.com, Tim's the hardest author to work with and edit because of his ego and attitude. Being the first at something tends to do that to you.

Anyway, Tim apparently doesn't give a hoot about what other people have written (one of the reasons why he wasn't asked to write for the NJO) and flies in the face of other people's characters.

The only real friend he has in the SW author community is Mike Stackpole, and it appears that he's gonna fly in his face this time. Shame shame. I like Zahn's work, but when he's doin' stuff like this, it kinda pisses me off.

~JTS

[Luvinna.]

Just a question I don't know the answer to: who comes up with SW EU story ideas? Is it the author who then submits it to Lucasbooks, or do the folks at Lucasbooks come up with the ideas and then find an author to write the book?

[Brian]

Originally posted by Luvinna+Jun 18 2003, 01:55 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Luvinna @ Jun 18 2003, 01:55 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'> <!--QuoteBegin-O-B-GATES@Jun 18 2003, 11:11 AM
TZ?
Who's the book by, OB? style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/wink.gif [/b][/quote]
D'oh! Zahn...

[Brian]

Originally posted by Luvinna@Jun 18 2003, 02:49 PM
Just a question I don't know the answer to: who comes up with SW EU story ideas? Is it the author who then submits it to Lucasbooks, or do the folks at Lucasbooks come up with the ideas and then find an author to write the book?
I think it's a bit of both. Lucasbooks will come up with a theme like "a story in the New Republic era featuring Han and Leia," and they give the author reign over what the plot and stuff will be (e.g. Tatooine Ghost by Troy Denning).

[Whuffa]

Does anyone else hate the cover? Mara looks awful. She reminds me of that doctor from Star Trek: The Next Generation. The Mara on Luvinna's avatar looks ten times better.

[Luvinna.]

Originally posted by Whuffa+Jun 19 2003, 08:08 AM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(Whuffa @ Jun 19 2003, 08:08 AM)</div><div class='quotemain'>Does anyone else hate the cover? Mara looks awful. She reminds me of that doctor from Star Trek: The Next Generation.[/b]
Have to agree, Wuffa. I don't like the cover. Though, I was thinking Mara looked like a cross between Shannon Baksa (who's representation of Mara I don't really like) and Jaina on the cover of Dark Journey. But it does look a little like Beverly Crusher, too.
<!--QuoteBegin-Whuffa@Jun 19 2003, 08:08 AM
The Mara on Luvinna's avatar looks ten times better.[/quote]
Thanks. I think so too. style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/hehe.gif

[jade51999]

LOL didn't realize there was already a thread going..
oh well i posted the whole summary in another thread that's somewhere around here if no one wants to navigate outside the boards..

style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif

JamesTSkywalker..that's really sad to hear..and i hope its just a rumour..b/c he's a really good author..and i'd hate to see continuity messups just when they were getting good at not having messups..

[Brian]

jade, post it in here.

[Marbleman]

mara looks like jennifer aniston on the cover. ???

[Whuffa]

Jennifer Aniston? I don't see it. But if she did, at least she'd look good. I hate Shannon Baska. I'd like to form a Shannon Baska hate-club.

[bluemilk]

Originally posted by Whuffa@Jun 19 2003, 07:08 AM
Does anyone else hate the cover? Mara looks awful. She reminds me of that doctor from Star Trek: The Next Generation. The Mara on Luvinna's avatar looks ten times better.
*lol* I was thinking the same thing, that she looks like Gates McFadden! I didn't think anyone else would notice that and I didn't want to give away my darkside Trekkie-ish nature style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/blush.gif

[Luvinna.]

Originally posted by Whuffa@Jun 20 2003, 03:45 AM
Jennifer Aniston? I don't see it. But if she did, at least she'd look good. I hate Shannon Baska. I'd like to form a Shannon Baska hate-club.
I'll join it. style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tongue.gif style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif

[Brian]

Originally posted by Whuffa@Jun 20 2003, 05:45 AM
Jennifer Aniston? I don't see it. But if she did, at least she'd look good. I hate Shannon Baska. I'd like to form a Shannon Baska hate-club.
i see it.

[Luvinna.]

I had a thought last night about the continuity thing. Maybe when this communication comes in from Nirauan, only the Chief of State, whoever that may be (please not Borsk!), and his/her top advisors know about it, and they keep it hush-hush (though I don't know why they would). Because the OFP was a group of Jedi, they naturally would contact Luke to see if he wants to go check it out. Luke doesn't have to tell them that he's been to Nirauan before, he just takes the people who are assigned to go with him and goes. Afterward, everyone involved is sworn to secrecy (though again, not sure why) and sometime between then and the NJO, there's a change of government (it is a democracy, right?) and the new leadership is never told about it.

Okay. I'm rationalizing. It sounded like a good explaination last night. ???

[Whuffa]

Actually I re-read the first YJK series recently and in the first book, "Heirs of the Force", Han and Chewie arrive on Yavin 4 with an important message for Luke which forces him to leave right away and he doesn't return 'till the end of the book. The book never says where he ran off to. Maybe this was the message from Nirauan. And since Leia is chief of state during that time (it is mentioned several times in the book) maybe she recieved it and didn't read it out of respect for Luke's privacy, and just sent it to Yavin 4. Or maybe it was incripted and only Luke could read it.

[Luvinna.]

When doesn't Luke take off on an urgent mission and not return until the end of the book in the YJK? Two, three times out of 14 books? style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tongue.gif

Seriously though, that's a good possiblity for the time period. The thing I'm most concerned about is the fact that there is supposed to be an Imperial and an NR amassador on the mission w/ Luke and Mara (according to the summary at sw.com), and yet in Mike Stackpole's Onslaught (I think), when the Chiss show up, everyone seems so surprised, like no one knew about them. Even the Imperials. That's what I'm trying to come up with a way to explain. Maybe I should just go reread that book and see if I'm remembering it wrong. style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/unsure.gif

[Master_MJade]

Originally posted by jade51999@Oct 7 2002, 10:49 PM
Thanks JTS! (BTW where was that actually written? i remember reading it but i can't remember where..)
it was written i believe in vector prime

Seriously though, that's a good possiblity for the time period. The thing I'm most concerned about is the fact that there is supposed to be an Imperial and an NR amassador on the mission w/ Luke and Mara (according to the summary at sw.com), and yet in Mike Stackpole's Onslaught (I think), when the Chiss show up, everyone seems so surprised, like no one knew about them. Even the Imperials. That's what I'm trying to come up with a way to explain. Maybe I should just go reread that book and see if I'm remembering it wrong.

actually Mara know about them and so did Luke but the didn't expect them to show up and fight...and most likely so did the imps

[Luvinna.]

Originally posted by Master_MJade@Jun 20 2003, 12:57 PM
actually Mara know about them and so did Luke but the didn't expect them to show up and fight...and most likely so did the imps
Good point. My impression from the Hand of Thrawn duology was that the Imps didn't know about the Chiss. That was the whole reason Mara crashed the Fire into the Hand's hanger bay; so that they couldn't give the Imps the information in the databanks. The Imps maybe knew about the Chiss and just didn't expect them to show up, like you said.

Still, the summary says there's a NR representative with them. ("Joining Luke and Mara Jade on their strange journey ... a New Republic ambassador who harbors his own mysterious agenda.") The fact that there's a NR ambassador suggests the NR [i]should have known about the Chiss which is not the case when they showed up in Onslaught. That's the most obvious continuity issue I see right now. So I'm speculating and trying to come up with ways that they could get around it.

[Marbleman]

Originally posted by O-B-GATES+Jun 20 2003, 09:47 AM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(O-B-GATES @ Jun 20 2003, 09:47 AM)</div><div class='quotemain'> <!--QuoteBegin-Whuffa@Jun 20 2003, 05:45 AM
Jennifer Aniston? I don't see it. But if she did, at least she'd look good. I hate Shannon Baska. I'd like to form a Shannon Baska hate-club.
i see it. [/b][/quote]
thanks obgates. now i know im not completely crazy.

[Whuffa]

Maybe the NR and Imperial representatives will die

[Brian]

Originally posted by marbleman84+Jun 20 2003, 05:10 PM--><div class='quotetop'>QUOTE(marbleman84 @ Jun 20 2003, 05:10 PM)</div><div class='quotemain'> Originally posted by O-B-GATES@Jun 20 2003, 09:47 AM
<!--QuoteBegin-Whuffa@Jun 20 2003, 05:45 AM
Jennifer Aniston? I don't see it. But if she did, at least she'd look good. I hate Shannon Baska. I'd like to form a Shannon Baska hate-club.
i see it.
thanks obgates. now i know im not completely crazy. [/b][/quote]
Of course not, you're marbles. style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/laugh.gif style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/hehe.gif style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/tongue.gif

[Soontir Solo]

I hope we get a glimpse of Pellaeon in this book, it would be nice to see what he is like between NJO and the Hand of Thrawn duology.

[aarinskywalker61]

<span style='color:purple'>I can't wait for Zahn's Luke And Mara Novel, I style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/inlove.gif the cover style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/bigsmile.gif</span>

[3rdgenerationfett]

ok so i think this book sounds pretty awesome. lots of chiss and unknown regions! its gonna be good me thinks. 2004? when in 04?

[3rdgenerationfett]

im with whuffa, i bet the NR ambassador is assigned secretly by leia, but he has his own agendas. he turns out bein the bad guy. and then he dies. so he doesnt tell anyone else of the chiss.

[Luvinna.]

Originally posted by 3rdgenerationfett@Jul 23 2003, 12:17 PM
ok so i think this book sounds pretty awesome. lots of chiss and unknown regions! its gonna be good me thinks. 2004? when in 04?
February. Don't have a specific date yet. style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/mellow.gif

[Luvinna.]

Originally posted by 3rdgenerationfett@Jul 23 2003, 12:33 PM
im with whuffa, i bet the NR ambassador is assigned secretly by leia, but he has his own agendas. he turns out bein the bad guy. and then he dies. so he doesnt tell anyone else of the chiss.
That would solve the problem, wouldn't it?

[DarthSolo]

yes that seemingly would solve the problem...or would it style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/unsure.gif .

This book sounds pretty cool. february huh? thats not too long of a wait. well yes it is, but at least its not like the end of 04.

[Luminara Skye]

The cover is reminiscent of Tatooine Ghost. style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif I guess it's fitting since it's by the same artist. ???

[CzulkangLah]

Originally posted by Soontir Solo@Jun 22 2003, 05:05 PM
I hope we get a glimpse of Pellaeon in this book, it would be nice to see what he is like between NJO and the Hand of Thrawn duology.
Amen brother.

[Whuffa]

Originally posted by Luminara Skye@Jul 25 2003, 08:18 PM
The cover is reminiscent of Tatooine Ghost. style_emoticons/<#EMO_DIR#>/smile.gif I guess it's fitting since it's by the same artist. ???
I think they're companion books, they both deal with the most famous SW couples and they're both followed by Star Wars valentine specials.

[Leiafan]

Oh goody, more tripe from Retcon Zahn. In this book, we'll learn that Mara was working in a soup kitchen all along and Palpatine tricked her into thinking she was an assassin, via a mind implant or something.

Why the hell do Luke and Mara get a valentine comic? All L/M fans have to do to see a valentine to their couple is pick up practically any of the NJO books.

The H/L valentine was a copout. It was set before their romance began in ESB. No, they couldn't put actual romance in the comic, could they? I am sure that the L/M valentine comic will be saturated with mushy lovey-dovey junk, just like the "Union" comic was -- contrast that with COPL, which split H/L up for most of the book and focused ONE WHOLE PAGE on their wedding.

Why the bias toward Luke and Mara? Han and Leia have won every "favorite SW couples" poll I've ever seen, while Luke and Mara have placed a distant second, and sometimes even third, yet Del Rey and Dark Horse go out of their way to please their fans while abusing/neglecting Han/Leia's fans. It was only after three years of complaining that H/L fans got anything like the goodies L/M fans have gotten all along, and even then, it was stingy. An unromantic comic and a novel that was really more about Shmi than about Han/Leia. Meanwhile, Luke/Mara continued to get all the love scenes in the NJO books, and now they're getting a novel entirely about them, no supporting characters, plus a valentine comic no doubt stuffed with kissing/love scenes.

[Jedi_of_the_North]

I will concede to you that fact that you have the right to express your opinions but the sarcasm is one thing that I do not wish to stand for.

Let's look at your arguments line by line

First of all COPL was a perfect way to show their relationship. We have Leia wrestling w/the idea of marrying Prince Isolder while Han is being bribed by him not to marry Leia. It may not have had the mushy romance you'd like to see between those two, but is showcases an even better form of romance in the fact that no matter what the obstacles they had [it's been a while since I read that one] they still found a way back to each other. That shows their love. That IMO is a much better way of showing the romance between a couple than all the love scenes Luke and Mara get in the NJO.

Next we see that everyone and their dog that has watched the STAR WARS movies knows how that relationship evolved and those that continued on in the EU got to see it for many years before the NJO. Now it is Luke and Mara's turn. Luke never really had anyone through the entire movie while we could see all the sexual tension between Han and Leia on screen. We got most of what you asked for in the movies. We even still got to see the relationship between Han and Leia, especially based in the Agents of Chaos series where we got to see how that relationship was dealing under the strain of Han going off the deep end after Chewie was killed. The caring and understanding of Leia during that time only cemented that relationship in every fan's mind. Luke and Mara haven't had all that much of a relationship in the books. Let's finally get a chance to see what goes on. We've seen Han and Leia since the beginning of STAR WARS now let's actually see a little bit of the real relationship between Luke and Mara.

[DarthSolo]

yes, luke deserves a wife also. many people hate mara, but its still his wife, and why shouldnt we see his romance with her develop like we did han and leias?

[Handothrawn]

Originally posted by Leiafan@Oct 28 2003, 01:32 PM
Oh goody, more tripe from Retcon Zahn. In this book, we'll learn that Mara was working in a soup kitchen all along and Palpatine tricked her into thinking she was an assassin, via a mind implant or something.

Why the hell do Luke and Mara get a valentine comic? All L/M fans have to do to see a valentine to their couple is pick up practically any of the NJO books.

The H/L valentine was a copout. It was set before their romance began in ESB. No, they couldn't put actual romance in the comic, could they? I am sure that the L/M valentine comic will be saturated with mushy lovey-dovey junk, just like the "Union" comic was -- contrast that with COPL, which split H/L up for most of the book and focused ONE WHOLE PAGE on their wedding.

Why the bias toward Luke and Mara? Han and Leia have won every "favorite SW couples" poll I've ever seen, while Luke and Mara have placed a distant second, and sometimes even third, yet Del Rey and Dark Horse go out of their way to please their fans while abusing/neglecting Han/Leia's fans. It was only after three years of complaining that H/L fans got anything like the goodies L/M fans have gotten all along, and even then, it was stingy. An unromantic comic and a novel that was really more about Shmi than about Han/Leia. Meanwhile, Luke/Mara continued to get all the love scenes in the NJO books, and now they're getting a novel entirely about them, no supporting characters, plus a valentine comic no doubt stuffed with kissing/love scenes.
Yeah, because heaven for bid Luke fall in love, and express it.

We always knew Han and Leia were going to end up together, it was obvious since they first met. Luke and Mara had to work at it, Luke was alone for twenty some years, he watched his best friend and his sister bang out three kids, and he didn't have anything but grief in every relationship he had before the NJO.

Oh and you really can't call Mara half trained, I mean how long was lLuke on Dagobah, three, four weeks?

[Leiafan]

I will concede to you that fact that you have the right to express your opinions but the sarcasm is one thing that I do not wish to stand for.

Let's look at your arguments line by line

First of all COPL was a perfect way to show their relationship.

Oh my Lord, you have GOT to be kidding me! COPL was a pile of tripe written by someone who either never saw ESB at all, or saw it while drunk! COPL completely RUINS both Han and Leia as characters, and craps all over their romance. They wait 4 years to get married? WTH? Lucas originally planned to end ROTJ with their wedding. I imagine they waited a year, at most, to get married. 4 years is just stupid and makes no sense.

We have Leia wrestling w/the idea of marrying Prince Isolder while Han is being bribed by him not to marry Leia. It may not have had the mushy romance you'd like to see between those two, but is showcases an even better form of romance

How? By making Leia into a stuck-up ice queen who forgets all she and Han had because some pretty-boy rich prince shows up? By making Han into a whining loser and then a psycho who shoots Leia with a stun gun and kidnaps her? By making Leia so fickle that she falls out of love with Han, in love with Isoldork, then out of love with Isoldork and back in love with Han, all in the period of, what, a few weeks? By crapping all over their romance with lines such as, "Leia tried to remember how she felt when Han was frozen in carbonite" (how anyone could watch the carbon-freezing scene in ESB, see Leia's expression as Han is lowered into the chamber, then write crap like that is beyond my comprehension) and "all her feelings for Han were as insubstantial as mist, and Isolder was the sun, burning them all away"?

Not to mention, who was that jerk in the Luke costume and what did he do with the real Luke? He encourages Leia to forget all about Han and marry some romance novel cover model prince, with a bee-yotch from hell for a mother?

in the fact that no matter what the obstacles they had [it's been a while since I read that one] they still found a way back to each other. That shows their love. That IMO is a much better way of showing the romance between a couple than all the love scenes Luke and Mara get in the NJO.

No, the few, extremely stingy scenes they got in the NJO, post-Balance Point, shows their love way more than Luke and Mara's repeated Force-enhanced boffing sessions and mush-spewing ever could. COPL is an abortion of a book that should be wiped from existence, although I did appreciate how Troy Denning fixed as much of it as he could in "Tatooine Ghost." He was quoted at some convention as saying that he disliked COPL and found it very out of character for Leia. His fix required a little retconning, but for once, I didn't mind.


Next we see that everyone and their dog that has watched the STAR WARS movies knows how that relationship evolved

Then it devolves in COPL. Ugh.

and those that continued on in the EU got to see it for many years before the NJO. Now it is Luke and Mara's turn.

*groan* Not this argument again. It's "Luke and Mara's turn"? What, is the GFFA not big enough for two couples? Or can only one couple be happy at a time?

Anyway, Luke and Mara have had their turn, way more of a turn than Han and Leia ever got -- even in the Bantam novels they were apart more than they were together, and Luke and Mara got more love scenes in two or three NJO books than Han and Leia got in the entire Bantam series.

Luke never really had anyone through the entire movie while we could see all the sexual tension between Han and Leia on screen. We got most of what you asked for in the movies. We even still got to see the relationship between Han and Leia, especially based in the Agents of Chaos series where we got to see how that relationship was dealing under the strain of Han going off the deep end after Chewie was killed.

And just like COPL, it crapped all over the H/L relationship. Han thinking of "the good times" with some stupid junkie bimbo who backstabbed him, the implication being that all the times since weren't as good. Han is unspeakably cruel to Leia, even throwing Alderaan in her face. Then he runs off, and barely thinks of Leia at all, as if his marriage doesn't matter.

The caring and understanding of Leia during that time only cemented that relationship in every fan's mind. Luke and Mara haven't had all that much of a relationship in the books.

Except in the NJO, where we see stuff like, "They were a team in a way that Han and Leia could never understand," and other references to their almighty Force Bond, which makes them the Greatest. Couple. Ever!

Let's finally get a chance to see what goes on. We've seen Han and Leia since the beginning of STAR WARS now let's actually see a little bit of the real relationship between Luke and Mara.

We've already seen a LOT of the "real relationship" between Luke and Mara. For an entire series. It's been rammed down our throats for 19 books.

So, and this is going by your logic, Luke and Mara have "had their turn." Since the GFFA can't have two happy couples at the same time, why not have Luke verbally abuse Mara and start drinking, then walk out on her and think dreamily of Callista, and then shave Mara's head and brutally torture her, while Luke barely cares, then kill their kid? Meanwhile, Han and Leia enjoy nonstop love scenes and intimate moments, have a baby, and get their love extolled at Luke/Mara's expense?

[Leiafan]

yes, luke deserves a wife also.

He deserves a wife, not an insensitive, stuck-up ubershrew like Mara. He deserves a woman who is strong without being a b*tch like Mara is. He deserves a woman who respects him rather than cutting him down like Mara does. He deserves a wife who isn't afraid to stand up to him, but doesn't dominate him like Mara does.

many people hate mara, but its still his wife, and why shouldnt we see his romance with her develop like we did han and leias?

Yeah, why shouldn't we see that, instead of seeing Mara slowly rob Luke of his spine and brain, and him devolve into a lapdog who cares about nothing except when they boffed last or when they'll boff next?

[Leiafan]

Yeah, because heaven for bid Luke fall in love, and express it.

When did Luke do that? Oh, with Callista. With Mara it's, "Yes, Mara. Whatever you say, Mara. Oh, can I have my spine back, just for today, Mara?"

We always knew Han and Leia were going to end up together, it was obvious since they first met.

No it wasn't. Most people expected her to fall for Luke after the original movie came out. I know because I was there.

Luke and Mara had to work at it,

Unlike Han and Leia, who had to work at it for three years and survive Han's carbon freezing as their love was just blossoming?

Luke was alone for twenty some years, he watched his best friend and his sister bang out three kids, and he didn't have anything but grief in every relationship he had before the NJO.

Because there was an internal memo to keep his love life screwed up so as to clear the path for Mara. Zahn had threatened to not write any more books unless he could mate Luke to Mara. That comes from Zahn himself.

Oh and you really can't call Mara half trained, I mean how long was lLuke on Dagobah, three, four weeks?

We don't know. He ran from his training before it was complete. He was forced into Jedihood via a trial by fire: facing Vader. Mara never was. Mara ran from her training repeatedly, and then magically was made not just a Jedi but a Jedi master, AFTER she had sniped at Luke for declaring himself a master after only 10 years. She was made one in what, five minutes?

Using your logic, Leia too should be a Jedi, if not a Jedi master, because she trained longer than Luke did on Dagobah. So why is she "half-trained and uncertain in the Force"?

[Jedi_of_the_North]

Originally posted by Leiafan@Oct 29 2003, 04:32 PM
*groan* Not this argument again. It's "Luke and Mara's turn"? What, is the GFFA not big enough for two couples? Or can only one couple be happy at a time?

In your mind it seems to be only big enough for one happy couple and you're ticked off that it's not Han and Leia.

You keep ranting on about how Han and Leia keep getting the shaft. We know their relationship is fine and we have just as much right to see theirs as we do Luke and Mara. It's clear both couples are happy but there are different levels of love and commitment. Luke and Mara are still at the very physical stage, but Han and Leia have moved on to a deeper stage of commitment. Han and Leia still have plenty of love for each other we just don't see it expressed in the same way.

[Leiafan]

In your mind it seems to be only big enough for one happy couple and you're ticked off that it's not Han and Leia.

Please don't project your own beliefs back onto me. You were the one who said that it was "Luke and Mara's turn." I said, "Isn't the GFFA big enough for two happy couples?" I have absolutely no problems with Luke and Mara being happy. I have a huge problem with Han and Leia getting nothing but abuse and derision, and even being separated.


You keep ranting on about how Han and Leia keep getting the shaft. We know their relationship is fine and we have just as much right to see theirs as we do Luke and Mara.

So how come you said it was "Luke and Mara's turn"?

It's clear both couples are happy but there are different levels of love and commitment. Luke and Mara are still at the very physical stage,

After seven years? That's a mighty long honeymoon. Han and Leia never got that, anyway. In TTT they were newlyweds and didn't get any love scenes at all, let alone the near-constant ones Luke and Mara got.

but Han and Leia have moved on to a deeper stage of commitment. Han and Leia still have plenty of love for each other we just don't see it expressed in the same way.

No, because Luke and Mara always get served first and any personal scenes after that would be "redundant." This is according to the author of "Destiny's Way." Han/Leia fans had been looking forward to seeing Han and Leia's reunion with Jacen, since they'd been gypped out of so many personal scenes already (due to author preference for Luke and Mara). Their reunion was three paragraphs long and told in flashback. Luke and Mara got a big long reunion with him, in which they acted like they really missed him when in fact they couldn't have cared less and mocked Leia behind her back for believing he was still alive.

H/L fans were justifiably annoyed, and when they asked the author why, he said because Luke and Mara already had a reunion and any after that would've been redundant. Oh, it would've been redundant to show Han and Leia's reunion with their only living son, after they had been sick with worry and grief for so long? No, the author couldn't have made Luke and Mara's reunion with him three paragraphs long and told in flashback, which would've been fitting considering they didn't care when he was missing, and then given the lengthy reunion to Han and Leia, no...Luke and Mara always have to be served first, and get the bigger portion than Han and Leia...if Han and Leia get a portion at all, which they usually don't.

[3rdgenerationfett]

you keep refering to H/L relationship as abusive. HOW MANY TIMES DID YOU READ AOC? thos e are the only books where it is abusive, the rest of the series they are working together!!! and heck, if your best friend just had a moon fall ontop of him wouldnt you have a few drinks also. yeah, han didnt handle it great, and leia got screwed for 2 books, but han was a smuggler and nerfherder scum from the start, in tragic times that is naturally where he is going to return to. now quit griping because the story didnt go how you wanted it to.

[Leiafan]

you keep refering to H/L relationship as abusive.

No I don't. I have said that they haved been abused, not abusive.

but han was a smuggler and nerfherder scum from the start,

Yeah, and he grew out of it by ROTJ.

in tragic times that is naturally where he is going to return to.

Naturally? In tragic times he would turn to his family, not say horrible things to them and drown in booze.

now quit griping because the story didnt go how you wanted it to.

Why not? Mara fans are still griping over her hair not being described as "red gold" in one book, and wouldn't stop griping when Han/Leia fans got a few crumbs this year. It got them a book entirely about L/M and a valentine comic that, unlike the H/L one, will no doubt be stuffed with romance.

[Handothrawn]

Who can say how anyone would react in that situation, the loss of a best friend would be enough to drive most anyone to drinking.

[Leiafan]

Who can say how anyone would react in that situation, the loss of a best friend would be enough to drive most anyone to drinking.

Ah yes, again, Han and Leia get all the "realism" while Luke and Mara get none of it, being in their little protective bubble where nothing affects them, including the deaths of family members.

[DelReyPublicity]

Hi all -

I am booking the tour for Timothy Zahn right now, so hopefully you will see him in your hometown soon enough and ask him all these questions yourself.

Cheers!

Collen @ Del Rey

clindsay@randomhouse.com