R2-D2: How Well Maintained Is He Now?

[bigscreensatellite]

it struck me, after watching TPM and ANH back to back, that R2 is an odd fellow...

In TPM, R2 basically saves the entire Royal Spaceship and crew, and avoids being blown off the hull whilst fixing the hyperdrive in the face of constant laser attack, using some kind of magnetic suction to keep him stable.

And in RoTS, R2 can be seen easily defeating two fairly large Superbattle droids, but when it comes to 20+ years later in ANH - he is basically 'out of shape'.

It's either him (or C-3PO) that loses a coil that one of the Sandtroopers states 'look, sir Droids', on Tatooine - the first fault.

Then, not long after that, he goes and gets captured by a gang three foot Jawa's with nothing more than a 'crappy' tazer type gun, which not only disables him but knocks him straight over with relative ease.

Has R2 got really out of shape since the days of the PM? I know Luke says that the little droid has some carbon scoring but surely he's been kept 'serviced' aboard the rebel blockade runner.

What's up with the older generation R2, his booster rockets don't seem to work, he has no defence mechanisms which he had in previous years... surely he would be over defensive, considering the important information he is holding??

(its the same in ESB too, when he slips off the hull off Luke's X-wing into the swap- has his magnetic runners worn off?)

R2, you need to see a mechanic, rather than getting polished up for Medal ceremonies, someone needs to take a look under your hood...

:artoo:

[Master_Kinnon]

Lol poor R2, the ravages of age and all that. But I'm sure that it says somewhere that his boosters are taken off him following ROTS and replaced with something else, although what could be more useful than a droid with booster rockets?

[Sluggo]

CGI filming techniques.

[Blagr Diath of Advil]

R-2 is a little worn out but you have to remember all that he has been through. i mean if u had been through all that he had been without being taken apart a couple of times you would be a little worn out 2. i mean even C3PO got taken apart and lost his head. R2s physical layout may be a little rusty but his intelligence hasn't slounched any in my opinion.
*Blagr Diath*(of Advil)

[Jedi Master Harrison]

I may be wrong but I thought that Anakin had made certain unusual upgrades to R2. After ROTS, these would no longer have been maintained, presumably.

[Master_Kinnon]

The man may speaketh the truth. Probably worth investigation.

[thepepgal]

The AOTC visual dictionary showed the booster rockets and it mentions they only had a life of 20 years. This means by the time ANH they no longer work.

The Alliance were short of funds and supplys with alot pilots having to supply their own ships. So while R2 would have been maintain the ability to gain replacement parts in a timely manner may have been difficult.

[Master_Kinnon]

Makes sense.

[thepepgal]

Makes sense.

Thanks.:)

[Master_Kinnon]

Sorry if that sounded patronising, it wasn't meant to.

[thepepgal]

Sorry if that sounded patronising, it wasn't meant to.

It didn't. I was thanking you for agreeing. that why I put the smiley face.

I always thought the secret bases wouldn't be always be on major routes (ie Dantooine) so if your droid had a issue with a component then you may have to wait for it to be replace. Remember C3PO offered and parts he had if it could repair R2 after the Death Star run. They obviously removed parts from non functioning droids where possible to keep others working.

[Master_Kinnon]

Cool, was just making sure!

Yeah I agree, the very nature of the Rebel Alliance would have meant coming across parts for anything less than essential maintenance would have been difficult.

[Lord Tesla]

The AOTC visual dictionary showed the booster rockets and it mentions they only had a life of 20 years. This means by the time ANH they no longer work.

The Alliance were short of funds and supplys with alot pilots having to supply their own ships. So while R2 would have been maintain the ability to gain replacement parts in a timely manner may have been difficult.


But was Artoo subject to those limitations? Or was he maintained by the Alderaanians as part of the holdings of the royal family? (At least while there still as an Alderaanian royal family, and an Alderaan.)

[Lord Tesla]

And in RoTS, R2 can be seen easily defeating two fairly large Superbattle droids, but when it comes to 20+ years later in ANH - he is basically 'out of shape'.

And yet, he still manages to save the day routinely in the OT. Stopping the garbage mashers, fixing the Millennium Falcon's hyperdrive, laying down smokescreens...

It's either him (or C-3PO) that loses a coil that one of the Sandtroopers states 'look, sir Droids', on Tatooine - the first fault.

Was that a coil? I thought it was a ring, a flat metal ring, in the nature of a washer or a grommet.

Then, not long after that, he goes and gets captured by a gang three foot Jawa's with nothing more than a 'crappy' tazer type gun, which not only disables him but knocks him straight over with relative ease.

Artoo took a dive. He needed transport and a charge. Temporarily submitting to Jawa captivity was his only option.

What's up with the older generation R2, his booster rockets don't seem to work, he has no defence mechanisms which he had in previous years... surely he would be over defensive, considering the important information he is holding??

The point raised earlier might have had something to do with the apparent decline in his abilities: scarcity of parts and service. However, he also suffered severe damage in the Death Star Trench, and may have lost some of those capacities as a consequence of those "wounds".

(its the same in ESB too, when he slips off the hull off Luke's X-wing into the swap- has his magnetic runners worn off?)

Can we be sure that the ability to cling to the Naboo cruiser was inherent in Artoo, and not in the cruiser itself? That hull type, and that hull material, were never seen in the original trilogy, and it might be as simple as that the trick wasn't possible on ships constructed differently, of different materials.

[thepepgal]

But was Artoo subject to those limitations? Or was he maintained by the Alderaanians as part of the holdings of the royal family? (At least while there still as an Alderaanian royal family, and an Alderaan.)

Just please realise, he came the property of the Alderaan royal family, doesn't mean they could afford to upgrade or replace all his parts. Look at Naboo, a queen's handmaiden (albeit Padme) actually cleaned R2.

Between Ep 3 & Ep 4, the Alderaanians replace C3PO's leg with a different color being silver as opposed to another gold one. This may demonstrate that the royal family couldn't afford to replace everything.

Remember they hadn't upgraded their diplomat ship in 19 years and the droids were on the same ship. More evidence of a lack of funds of their part.

[Lord Tesla]

Just please realise, he came the property of the Alderaan royal family, doesn't mean they could afford to upgrade or replace all his parts. Look at Naboo, a queen's handmaiden (albeit Padme) actually cleaned R2.

Padmé's cleaning chore is not particularly relevant. First, the Naboo royal establishment, such as they were at that point, were essentially refugees. The Alderaanian Royal Family was not. Second, handmaiden droid cleaning may have been a tradition among the Naboo with nothing to do with the number of credits in the treasury or the supply of parts and qualified techs. Particularly for heroic droids, who might have been thought worthy of the human touch from persons of high station.

Between Ep 3 & Ep 4, the Alderaanians replace C3PO's leg with a different color being silver as opposed to another gold one. This may demonstrate that the royal family couldn't afford to replace everything.

Replacing a leg plate is evidence of...the inability to replace things? Not sure I follow the reasoning there.

Even if we were to assume that the mismatched leg plate is an indication of tightened means, it suggests that they were scrimping on cosmetic features, not useful functionality, in the droids.

Remember they hadn't upgraded their diplomat ship in 19 years and the droids were on the same ship. More evidence of a lack of funds of their part.

Or evidence of conservatism, traditionalism, or, as in the case of modern terrestrial militaries, a careful program of system upgrades: they had SLEPed the darn thing to keep the useful guts on the cutting edge, while leaving the basic fuselage/hull more or less unaltered.

[thepepgal]

Replacing a leg plate is evidence of...the inability to replace things? Not sure I follow the reasoning there.

Even if we were to assume that the mismatched leg plate is an indication of tightened means, it suggests that they were scrimping on cosmetic features, not useful functionality, in the droids.

Or evidence of conservatism, traditionalism, or, as in the case of modern terrestrial militaries, a careful program of system upgrades: they had SLEPed the darn thing to keep the useful guts on the cutting edge, while leaving the basic fuselage/hull more or less unaltered.

Yes I was referring to the fact that the Alderaanian royal family must be short of funds since royal family usually have everything matching including all the plates on droids. To have something less than perect reflected on them and their ability to pay and a position of power in negotiations.

Obviously from your point the Alderaanians decide that they didn't deem the booster rockets as a vital part of his functionality. C3PO's leg had to be replaced so he could walk but R2 could still move around without the rockets.

The discussion at the time was about the rebels and their maintainence of their equipment and they were short of funds.

It is also the reason that Lucasfilms released the information that they only lasted 20 years to show they didn't work while in the OT era.

Whether they have been replaced since then we don't know. Maybe the booster rockets are a discontinued item. :giveup:

[Kam Solusar]

The point raised earlier might have had something to do with the apparent decline in his abilities: scarcity of parts and service. However, he also suffered severe damage in the Death Star Trench, and may have lost some of those capacities as a consequence of those "wounds".


This was the very first thing I thought of, and for some reason it seems to be not brought up enough. R2 got WASTED in the trench run. It was probably only because he "belonged" to the savior of the Rebellion that they got him functional again. Who knows how much capablity he lost simply from taking a direct hit like that and having to be rebuilt from the dome up, and who knows what else needed to be replaced as a result.

[Mothman]

There is also the line of thinking (which has been expressed on many a thread here) that droids were as common an appliance in the SW galaxy as, for example, toasters are in ours.

Perhaps you just don't invest alot to maintain/repair a toaster that is over 20 years old.




:bye:

[flo fett]

There is also the line of thinking (which has been expressed on many a thread here) that droids were as common an appliance in the SW galaxy as, for example, toasters are in ours.

Perhaps you just don't invest alot to maintain/repair a toaster that is over 20 years old.

True enough.
*eyes her own dodgy toaster*
There's a certain 'droid' here that's going to be seeing the inside of a trash compacter very soon.

[Orandhite]

^ :D

[Darill Cyllem]

There is also the line of thinking (which has been expressed on many a thread here) that droids were as common an appliance in the SW galaxy as, for example, toasters are in ours.

Perhaps you just don't invest alot to maintain/repair a toaster that is over 20 years old.


If it's not easy to get a replacement toaster, however, one would try to fix the toaster one has - with whatever parts might be available.
So maybe only 2 of the 4 slots still work, but one must have one's toast!

And with an astromech droid, seems like it would be even more handy than a toaster. I know i sure wouldn't want to make calculations for the jump to lightspeed in my head or by hand... i'm sure i'd put us right through a star or bounce too close to a supernove, and that would end our trip pretty quick, wouldn't it....

[thepepgal]

Droids shouldn't be compared to toasters instead they should be compared to computers. Computers can be upgraded, can have obsolete parts replaced with newer ones. But the only reason you run a 20 year old pc is because the programme or what it is attached to won't run with a newer model.

R2 would have been modified over the years to ensure he wasn't obsolete. He would have been repair because of Luke and probably the damage wasn't as bad as it appears on screen. Remember they did offer Luke a new droid before the battle of Yavin and he decline on sentimentality of going through alot together.

I still have a computer that is 10 years old it still works and I sometimes play old dos games on it. It maybe my R2 but it hasn't saved my life yet like R2 did with Luke so I don't have that much of an attachement to it. I also have 3 other pcs: one that I'm currently on, another that doesn't work but using for the parts that still function and a laptop I was given for free but is 7 years old.

Don't forget you may be able to fly a X-wing without a droid but it is far easier with one.

[Jedi Master Elad Kenobi]

Also, the R2 units were originally built with the idea to have the droids on starfighters. The Empire would not want to have independant companies designing and producing Astromechs being built to be put on starfighters that may be piloted by "rebels". All the astromechs that might have been needed for the empire would have been made on contract for them by Arakyd Industries, who made the Probe droids, or by Republic Sienar Systems who had strong ties to Palpatine, who made Darth Maul's ship. So, palpatine may have just bought Industrial Automaton out.

[RollaFett]

:eh: I think I just had an EU brain freeze.

Ok, Elad, upon re-reading your post, I'm a little confused. Where does the Empire fit in with designing droids for starfighters? Remember, we saw R2 units on the fighters ships on Naboo. That was long before the Empire.

[Tovor]

And on Republic fighters during the Clone Wars...then on rebel fighters in the 2nd civil war, but never on TIEs or any other imperial fighters or vehicles.

[Darill Cyllem]

^That's because TIEs don't have navicomputers, so they don't need the astro droid to make hyperspace calculations.

[Tovor]

Nice geek answer! :ok:

[Jedi Master Elad Kenobi]

Just because the Empire didn't have them in the fighters, doesn't mean that the Star destroyers didn't use them. It would have taken hundreds of mechanics to keep the ship running without the Astromechs. Also, who would trust Wookies with hyperdrives? and who would patch the hulls? On the Frigates, crusiers and Imperial Star Destroyers the lowly astromech droid is an unsung hero. (Buy them NOW!)
Also, who would mantain the Death star? It would have taken thousands of man hours to keep the machinery in order without droids. But why give the rebels the same advantage of automated matenance, and wearing out the mechanics, so in the middle of a battle, when push comes to shove, some mechinacs may just collapse from the pressure. One of the many good affects. Also, the Empire had a ban on military astromechs (Military in the respect that the droids had hyperspace calulators and military ship blueprints.) In this sense, many companies could have gone bust, including the Industrial Automaton that made the R2 series.

[Blizzard]

^Now THAT is a geek answer. :clap:

[Darth Apotheosus]

thepepgal, your avatar is disturbing more than the Force! (sorry, can't stop laughing at it) Where in the world did you find that !?!

If Leia had somehow "always known" during the revelation in RotJ, what does that make her? (still laughing)

[RollaFett]

I second Blizz, that was indeed a geek answer. Obviously a well thought out one, as well, I might add. Full EU stuff, I can only assume.
Still, Elad, you really haven't addressed my original question. This is what you said:
Also, the R2 units were originally built with the idea to have the droids on starfighters. The Empire would not want to have independant companies designing and producing Astromechs being built to be put on starfighters that may be piloted by "rebels".
Ok, soooooo....if the R2 units were originally built for starfighters, what does it have to with the Empire if they pre-dated the Empire?

[Jedi Master Elad Kenobi]

I well deserve rep, that took forever to organize.

[thepepgal]

thepepgal, your avatar is disturbing more than the Force! (sorry, can't stop laughing at it) Where in the world did you find that !?!

If Leia had somehow "always known" during the revelation in RotJ, what does that make her? (still laughing)

It was an avatar that was offer by this very chatboard.

Leia may have known but didn't want to believe until faced with the fact.

Back on topic:

R2 units weren't built for the Empire but were used by them and every other organisation & government.

[RollaFett]

I well deserve rep, that took forever to organize.

Rep? Hell, how addressing my question first, smart guy?! :wink:


No, seriously, answer my question.

[Jedi Master Elad Kenobi]

Well, the R2 unit was one of the best-selling astromechs of all time, there was million's knocking 'round. So stopping new types of astromechs being developed AND stopping parts for exsisting models (e.g R2 models) was effectivly killing two birds with one stone.:rockon:

[RollaFett]

Okay, okay...let me see if I'm understanding you. You're original point means that once the Rebellion was formed and the Empire percieved them as a threat, they then attempted to stop the production of new astromech droids? Am I right?

[Jedi Master Elad Kenobi]

Yes, and in doing that stopped parts production and also the chance of the droids being serviced. Phew! The empire did this early on, so for about 18 years the droids had no warranty coverage or stuff (like my broken PSP-lol)

[Darth Apotheosus]

Yes, and in doing that stopped parts production and also the chance of the droids being serviced. Phew! The empire did this early on, so for about 18 years the droids had no warranty coverage or stuff (like my broken PSP-lol)

I think the burgeoning Empire would have been far more insidious.

Chancellor Palpatine would have had friends in the Senate who themselves or relatives were in the droid industry, as well as the spaceship crafting industry which would forego the use of droids for astrogation and repairs. He got kickbacks in the form of support and votes from these other senators when he 1) put massive tariffs on the import/export of R2 units specifically and 2) spent huge amounts of Republic money on his supporters droids and/or non-droid-use spacecraft.

Meanwhile, he had agents infiltrating the upper echelon of the R2 unit corporations in order to botch their customer service completely and, as said, far more insidiously. Instead of simply erasing warranty coverage, they bogged down any owners of malfunctioning R2s by constantly shifting them to yet another service representative until the purchaser got tired of trying to get parts/service and just decided to buy a completely different model - the ones manufactured by Palpatine's friends.

[Darth Nameless]

I think the burgeoning Empire would have been far more insidious.

Chancellor Palpatine would have had friends in the Senate who themselves or relatives were in the droid industry, as well as the spaceship crafting industry which would forego the use of droids for astrogation and repairs. He got kickbacks in the form of support and votes from these other senators when he 1) put massive tariffs on the import/export of R2 units specifically and 2) spent huge amounts of Republic money on his supporters droids and/or non-droid-use spacecraft.

Meanwhile, he had agents infiltrating the upper echelon of the R2 unit corporations in order to botch their customer service completely and, as said, far more insidiously. Instead of simply erasing warranty coverage, they bogged down any owners of malfunctioning R2s by constantly shifting them to yet another service representative until the purchaser got tired of trying to get parts/service and just decided to buy a completely different model - the ones manufactured by Palpatine's friends.

ok...huh? are you speaking from a situation in your life or did you read this somewhere? lol

[RollaFett]

Heh, heh...yeah, it seems as though we are currently very far removed from anything we've seen in the films at this point, huh?

[Darth Apotheosus]

ok...huh? are you speaking from a situation in your life or did you read this somewhere? lol

Um... I heard it from good old uncle Palpy himself. He didn't limit his war for domination on the battlefront alone. The dark side is EVERYWHERE!!!

[Darth Nameless]

But when was that explained in the movies?

[Darth Apotheosus]

Its not. It was made up. By me. On the fly. As a funny. Recalling a particularly grueling experience in trying to get a replacement PCMCIA wireless card for my laptop. But it could have happened that way! (Also, based somewhat on the current administration and its cronyism, but that's a point for another thread.)

Seriously, though - the point of my post is that the events which put Palpatine in power and set up the Republic for its own downfall would have come from sources other than simply engineering a war between his own two factions in order to gain leverage in the one which he really coveted, even though only that aspect of his rise to power was covered in the movies.

Certainly the "R" units played a much larger role in the GFFA at the time of the Clone Wars, and were virtually gone or refurbed by the time the rebels got ahold of them, and this could have been one scenario. I think its highly plausible he would have had his hands in many industries, especially those which contributed logisitically to the war. Its something worth exploring in the EU, if only as a sideplot.

[Jedi Master Elad Kenobi]

But mine was based on an EU book I read, called the Star wars book of droids (the older version).

[Darth Apotheosus]

Sheesh, man, I was just trying to be funny.

But... I wouldn't be surprised to see something like these scenarios cropping up in future retcons of the older material, to show everywhere Sidious' sinister hand has actually been.